no offense mooshie...but adding real science to theory is only gonna create a problem...real science...and this theory for Franz Hopper will clash..
so is Zero Point Space the base of the theory, and everything works from there, or is it just one point where things surround it?
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by Rail Runner » Sun Aug 06, 2006 9:12 pm
it seems like most of this theory is based off of the zero point space...and I was asking if this was the case, or if I missed something... 
Amtrak, its everywhere I want to be!
by Cassius335 » Mon Aug 07, 2006 2:53 pm
TB3 wrote:Hmm - nice work tangent.
One thought I have is that the monsters are programs, but XANA didn't lay down the programs which they are based on and which grants them vulnerability.
I think Franz designed the two monsters which probably came first - the Mantas and Creepers, and then XANA began making his own, building on the same software.
BTW: Chupathing42 suugested that XANA created Gravitons in Zero-Gravity-Zone and used those to offset gravity. Since this lines up with what I just wrote about ZPS I think he's a bloody genius! Anyone object to making him a Lyokologist?
Not really, just might be an idea to avoid explaining EVERYTHING away as being done by "somethingons". Gravitons and Lyokons are probably enough!
But yeah, Anoint him!
---
"There are advantages in being honest about your own limitations: you gain the right to talk about the limitations of others." - Science of The Discworld 3
by YDV » Mon Aug 07, 2006 4:30 pm
..xD;; Here comes Whydeevee with his crazy software notions...
Yeah. I actually thought that monsters were some sort of system application. Like, perhaps Franz intended for them to be used as some kind of messanger system or 'field worker.' You know how occasionally you can see through the monsters' eyes? Perhaps that was meant for seeing things in different sectors or something. Before the vehicles it was a lot of work to traverse Lyoko and maybe he didn't want to do everything himself (this is assuming the idea was conceived after he decided to actually -go- to Lyoko, since everything can be observed from the outside at the console.) Also, wouldn't they be a part of XANA's Mutliple-Agent-System? His 'eyes and ears' on Lyoko? I'm not sure. But they probably have some type of low-level AI.
I think I agree that the Mantas and the Creepers came first... if he planned on having a petting zoo for Aelita though I'm not sure what he was thinking xD;;
Yeah. I actually thought that monsters were some sort of system application. Like, perhaps Franz intended for them to be used as some kind of messanger system or 'field worker.' You know how occasionally you can see through the monsters' eyes? Perhaps that was meant for seeing things in different sectors or something. Before the vehicles it was a lot of work to traverse Lyoko and maybe he didn't want to do everything himself (this is assuming the idea was conceived after he decided to actually -go- to Lyoko, since everything can be observed from the outside at the console.) Also, wouldn't they be a part of XANA's Mutliple-Agent-System? His 'eyes and ears' on Lyoko? I'm not sure. But they probably have some type of low-level AI.
I think I agree that the Mantas and the Creepers came first... if he planned on having a petting zoo for Aelita though I'm not sure what he was thinking xD;;
BEHHHH
by Tangent128 » Tue Aug 08, 2006 5:54 pm
OK... I guess if all objects are required to have LP, then the monsters could be programs... but does everything have 100 LP, or is it calculated based on some other factors?
The problem with a game engine analogy is that in game engines, it is up to the monster designer to balance the game... in other words, a video game could have a monster with HP, defense, attack, and speed all set to 999,999,999, but that isn't done because such an enemy would make the game extremely unfun. Naturally, XANA doesn't want Lyoko to be fun, so what keeps him from creating, say, a 1000 LP Hornet with a 100 LP laser?
For that matter, why exactly do lifepoints exist? I doubt Lyoko would be programed to damage data just because of a collision event... unless perhaps such collision events allow XANA to briefly access and damage the avatar data himself?
If that were the case, then the Scyphozoa's memory drain would simply be a more refined version, and attacking towers would eventually allow for their shutdown.
Now that I think about it, because it is a Quantnum computer, any interacting data could influence each other, so weapon shots may be designed to disrupt data... and could maybe be designed to target a specific piece of data, as in the Marabounta virus.
Did I just answer my question?
The problem with a game engine analogy is that in game engines, it is up to the monster designer to balance the game... in other words, a video game could have a monster with HP, defense, attack, and speed all set to 999,999,999, but that isn't done because such an enemy would make the game extremely unfun. Naturally, XANA doesn't want Lyoko to be fun, so what keeps him from creating, say, a 1000 LP Hornet with a 100 LP laser?
For that matter, why exactly do lifepoints exist? I doubt Lyoko would be programed to damage data just because of a collision event... unless perhaps such collision events allow XANA to briefly access and damage the avatar data himself?
If that were the case, then the Scyphozoa's memory drain would simply be a more refined version, and attacking towers would eventually allow for their shutdown.
Now that I think about it, because it is a Quantnum computer, any interacting data could influence each other, so weapon shots may be designed to disrupt data... and could maybe be designed to target a specific piece of data, as in the Marabounta virus.
Did I just answer my question?
(yeah, the cool links in my old sig died. 
A few nerdy newish projects are here. )
A few nerdy newish projects are here. )
by YDV » Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:21 pm
Tangent128 wrote:OK... I guess if all objects are required to have LP, then the monsters could be programs... but does everything have 100 LP, or is it calculated based on some other factors?
The problem with a game engine analogy is that in game engines, it is up to the monster designer to balance the game... in other words, a video game could have a monster with HP, defense, attack, and speed all set to 999,999,999, but that isn't done because such an enemy would make the game extremely unfun. Naturally, XANA doesn't want Lyoko to be fun, so what keeps him from creating, say, a 1000 LP Hornet with a 100 LP laser?
For that matter, why exactly do lifepoints exist? I doubt Lyoko would be programed to damage data just because of a collision event... unless perhaps such collision events allow XANA to briefly access and damage the avatar data himself?
Now that I think about it, because it is a Quantnum computer, any interacting data could influence each other, so weapon shots may be designed to disrupt data... and could maybe be designed to target a specific piece of data, as in the Marabounta virus.
Did I just answer my question?
Possibly xD;; Yes, I've always thought that attacks were meant to damage the avatar file, and once it reached a certain point (Life Points reaching zero), the person is devirtualized before it can sustain sufficient fragmentation. So basically LP's are designed to keep avatar files intact (if they were seriously damaged, it could cause detrimental effects.)
BEHHHH
by Rail Runner » Tue Aug 08, 2006 8:58 pm
well...that makes sense...because everytime they are hit, the avatars show the LP loss...and the monsters..they must have less than 100 points, either that, or the groups lasers are a 100 point hit to the enemies...what do you think?
Amtrak, its everywhere I want to be!
by Chupathingy 42 » Wed Aug 09, 2006 9:40 am
When I said Game engine, it was the best thing I could use to explain how lyoko works on a code level, and while it's probably note the best, it is the best think I can think of that easily explains it. However, you are right; it is not a game engine. Now you brought up balancing and the question of why life points would even exist in the first place.
For balancing, I think that it is taken care of by the computer, which also probable sets the different life points for different things, biased on its attributes and different stats. We've also seen Xana bend if not break the balancing in things like possibly the Tarantula (an uber powerful monster compared to the) and defiantly the kids "super" weapons that he make as a trick (probably done by writing a work around of the default weapon code or by having access to a deferent part of the system, or by the fact he may have been using Franz’s mind at that point and could, with in limits, do anything he needed)
As to why life points exist, I think it's simply a safety measure. We've seen just how dangerous Lyoko can be on its own even with out XANA and we've seen that when the system (scanners and such) is shut down it can easily be fatal. Now the life points might not actually be something added to it but kind of one of those things that developed through requirement of the way lyoko works. Franz wanted Lyoko to be a fairly realistic world, as real as he could make it, and a real world and all of its objects have durability and with enough damage will wear out and be destroyed. Now granted on lyoko it's not like earth where everything does wear out, but we've seen the terrain of lyoko can be altered by objects, why shouldn't the objects also be able to be altered by each other (AKA destroyed by a laser)
As to the weapons disrupting data and all that... I don't think so normally. I think they are meant just as they look, to cause damage to what it hits. Yes, a virus was uploaded in to the arrow, but I think that was special. The reason I stand by this is very simple, if the weapon is made for specific data, then why:
Jeremie also probably (almost certainly) doesn’t have access to the monsters code and as such can't come up with a virus to combat them directly as well.
I hope this explains what I'm thinking
PS. When I made the game engine analogy, If I sounded like (or even said) that it was a game engine, please understand I didn't mean that it IS a super game engine, just that SOME of the thinks behind the process (like the classes) could be related to on... sorry about the confusion.
For balancing, I think that it is taken care of by the computer, which also probable sets the different life points for different things, biased on its attributes and different stats. We've also seen Xana bend if not break the balancing in things like possibly the Tarantula (an uber powerful monster compared to the) and defiantly the kids "super" weapons that he make as a trick (probably done by writing a work around of the default weapon code or by having access to a deferent part of the system, or by the fact he may have been using Franz’s mind at that point and could, with in limits, do anything he needed)
As to why life points exist, I think it's simply a safety measure. We've seen just how dangerous Lyoko can be on its own even with out XANA and we've seen that when the system (scanners and such) is shut down it can easily be fatal. Now the life points might not actually be something added to it but kind of one of those things that developed through requirement of the way lyoko works. Franz wanted Lyoko to be a fairly realistic world, as real as he could make it, and a real world and all of its objects have durability and with enough damage will wear out and be destroyed. Now granted on lyoko it's not like earth where everything does wear out, but we've seen the terrain of lyoko can be altered by objects, why shouldn't the objects also be able to be altered by each other (AKA destroyed by a laser)
As to the weapons disrupting data and all that... I don't think so normally. I think they are meant just as they look, to cause damage to what it hits. Yes, a virus was uploaded in to the arrow, but I think that was special. The reason I stand by this is very simple, if the weapon is made for specific data, then why:
- Does it not just destroy a monster on contact ANY WHERE as that is part of the data of a monster
- The weapons affect the kids and other objects (weapons and vehicles) and Lyoko it self, not just some specific data in the monster
Jeremie also probably (almost certainly) doesn’t have access to the monsters code and as such can't come up with a virus to combat them directly as well.
I hope this explains what I'm thinking
PS. When I made the game engine analogy, If I sounded like (or even said) that it was a game engine, please understand I didn't mean that it IS a super game engine, just that SOME of the thinks behind the process (like the classes) could be related to on... sorry about the confusion.
UNBANNABLE!
Some Might remember me as Chupathingy form TvTome many a year ago
From Red VS Blue Episode 2
Sarge: Hey Simmons, what’s the name of the Mexican lizard, eats all the goats?
Simmons: That would be the Chupacabra Sir.
Sarge: Hey Griff, Chupathingy, I like it. Got a ring to it.
Some Might remember me as Chupathingy form TvTome many a year ago
From Red VS Blue Episode 2
Sarge: Hey Simmons, what’s the name of the Mexican lizard, eats all the goats?
Simmons: That would be the Chupacabra Sir.
Sarge: Hey Griff, Chupathingy, I like it. Got a ring to it.
by Tangent128 » Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:59 pm
Chupathingy42 wrote:...
As to the weapons disrupting data and all that... I don't think so normally. I think they are meant just as they look, to cause damage to what it hits. Yes, a virus was uploaded in to the arrow, but I think that was special. The reason I stand by this is very simple, if the weapon is made for specific data, then why:Jeremie also probably (almost certainly) doesn’t have access to the monsters code and as such can't come up with a virus to combat them directly as well.
- Does it not just destroy a monster on contact ANY WHERE as that is part of the data of a monster
- The weapons affect the kids and other objects (weapons and vehicles) and Lyoko it self, not just some specific data in the monster
...
I'm sorry, I wasn't too clear on that point...
You're right, Jeremy almost certainly can't access the monsters' code; I think the weapon shots are just generic disruptors- they scramble whatever data they are lucky enough to come in contact with, regardless of its type. Eye hits are likely fatal because they represent the critical data linking the monster to XANA/its AI/whatever controls it; the other data can be repaired or is redundant.
However, since Jeremy did have the code to the Marabounta, he could create a much more specific disruptor that would rewrite the replication code into self-destruct code- in other words, it's like the difference between deleting random files and replacing the OS with a formating program.
Even if Jeremie did get the code to a monster, any virus would only work once- XANA could just reshuffle the code, moving the weak spot to an unknown position.
Is that clearer?
(yeah, the cool links in my old sig died. A few nerdy newish projects are here. )
A few nerdy newish projects are here. )by TB3 » Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:00 pm
(reads above)
So...much...software!
Brain...cannot...compute!
Lol, so guys - can you start submitting your personal soundbites and when I finish the essay (very soon I hope), I'll put it up here for scrutiny
So...much...software!
Brain...cannot...compute!
Lol, so guys - can you start submitting your personal soundbites and when I finish the essay (very soon I hope), I'll put it up here for scrutiny
LORD HIGH TRANSLATOR!
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
by Jeremified » Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:27 pm
TB3 wrote:Jeremified wrote:Okay, mind if I expand the current topic? I haven't been very active in this topic lately.
Think about how re-materialization of the object's atoms would act- if it merely stored the atoms at the time of virtualization, then when you were re-materialized, your heart, brain, and all energy would be lost. Thus the energy of your body would have to be saved and restored somehow.
That's were lovely Quantum comes in - on the Quantum scale, matter and energy are made of the same material, so any energy would be picked up and encoded, and subsequently reconstructed with the body.
PS: Matter/Energy duality is another take really on Particle/Wave duality - i.e. it can be proven that an electron is a wave, and it can also be proven that an electron is a particle? How can this work?
Quantum, that's how.
Always Quantum!
o_o COOL. So, in order to calculate mass AND energy, you would need to have two numbers. Usually two numbers are shown on a plane. Does this mean that Quantum is 2-dimensional?
thank you all for the good memories 
by Rail Runner » Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:42 pm
having 2 numbers..may not make it 2 D...2D would be more like a few more numbers adding on to each other...or something like that.
Amtrak, its everywhere I want to be!
by mooshie » Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:50 pm
and of course, it may not nescesarilly be the first two dimensions, maybe the 9th and 10th, or something of that sort
A lot of member have sigs that say"I'm a boy", or "I'm a girl", I refuse to join this trend.
"Never let your morals get in the way of doing what's right" --Isaac Asimov
98% OF TEENS WON'T STAND UP FOR GOD..
only 2% to go
"Never let your morals get in the way of doing what's right" --Isaac Asimov
98% OF TEENS WON'T STAND UP FOR GOD..
only 2% to go
by Jeremified » Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:59 pm
Virtualized STI wrote:having 2 numbers..may not make it 2 D...2D would be more like a few more numbers adding on to each other...or something like that.
No, because think about it. Let's say the mass is 5 and energy is 3 or something. Add them together and you get 5+3=8. So the quantum's number is 8. Whoopee, guess what, there are INFINITE COMBINATIONS OF NUMBERS THAT EQUAL 8!!! 4+4, -3+11, 1000000+ -999992, they all make 8!!! Therefore it must have at least two parts to it.
thank you all for the good memories
by Cassius335 » Thu Aug 10, 2006 4:44 pm
TB3 wrote:(reads above)
So...much...software!
Brain...cannot...compute!
Lol, so guys - can you start submitting your personal soundbites and when I finish the essay (very soon I hope), I'll put it up here for scrutiny
Here or PM?
---
"There are advantages in being honest about your own limitations: you gain the right to talk about the limitations of others." - Science of The Discworld 3
by TB3 » Thu Aug 10, 2006 5:35 pm
Cassius335 wrote:TB3 wrote:(reads above)
So...much...software!
Brain...cannot...compute!
Lol, so guys - can you start submitting your personal soundbites and when I finish the essay (very soon I hope), I'll put it up here for scrutiny
Here or PM?
Your choice
- PM would be best I suppose, but in the end it's up to youLORD HIGH TRANSLATOR!
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
by YDV » Thu Aug 10, 2006 6:05 pm
TB3 wrote:(reads above)
So...much...software!
Brain...cannot...compute!
Lol, so guys - can you start submitting your personal soundbites and when I finish the essay (very soon I hope), I'll put it up here for scrutiny
.....Soundbites. Do they have to be soundbites? xD; Because at the moment I like.. wouldn't be able to record anything.
BEHHHH
by TB3 » Thu Aug 10, 2006 6:24 pm
Brybry wrote:TB3 wrote:(reads above)
So...much...software!
Brain...cannot...compute!
Lol, so guys - can you start submitting your personal soundbites and when I finish the essay (very soon I hope), I'll put it up here for scrutiny
.....Soundbites. Do they have to be soundbites? xD; Because at the moment I like.. wouldn't be able to record anything.
When I say soundbites I mean something written - a paragraph, a sentance a page - whatever you like
LORD HIGH TRANSLATOR!
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
by TB3 » Sat Aug 12, 2006 9:57 am
Thanks YDV!
Oh, and is this okay for everyone?
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c345/Thunderbird3/Scanners.jpg
Oh, and is this okay for everyone?
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c345/Thunderbird3/Scanners.jpg
LORD HIGH TRANSLATOR!
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
by Jeremified » Sat Aug 12, 2006 12:31 pm
Very good detail, TB3!
thank you all for the good memories
by TB3 » Sat Aug 12, 2006 6:06 pm
Thanks guys - motivated to go even further, I just churned out this!
I'm insane I suppose - propably explains this - but it'll look real pretty in the essay!
Scanner-Cut-Away
I'm insane I suppose - propably explains this - but it'll look real pretty in the essay!
Scanner-Cut-Away
LORD HIGH TRANSLATOR!
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
Joined Sept. 16th 2005, Post Tally 6423 (as of January 21st 2010)
by Rail Runner » Sun Aug 13, 2006 12:16 am
wow...that is just completely awesome...very good details...good job TB3.
Amtrak, its everywhere I want to be!
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