Let's Talk Tech II - Over a year of Tech! :)

[JeremieCompNerd offline]

I knew he was already in France. But I do science for the sake of science, not so it can be publicized in the cartoon.
This should help make my new theory as clear as mud. Let me know if you still don't get it.
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i1/je ... alloop.jpg

[Sithking Zero offline]

Okay, I kinda see what angle you're coming from, but still, how can the supercomputer from a destroyed/deleted timeline still have any power, let alone enough to send a message back in time?

[Cassius335 offline]

Not what he means. He means that the computer from the new timeline sends the data back to itself at the same point the computer from the old timeline did, to try to close up the paradox TB3 mentioned. Of course, that'd only work if nothing happens to the data-copy in the mean-time.

It would also mean the computer can talk to itself outside the RTTP without causing a third universe (maybe it can piggyback on whatevers left of the data stream from the ghost universe, using it as a navigation guide to send the more 'recent' copy)

[Chupathingy 42 offline]

MAN, I've missed a lot wile I've been busy. Well... can't wait till TB3 is back (and hopefully with good news)

SO, any thing new since he left?

[YDV offline]

[quote="JeremieCompNerd"]But I do science for the sake of science, not so it can be publicized in the cartoon.[/qoute]

....Technically we're NOT doing science, we're merely creating a bunch of plausible-sounding theories to explain science fiction. And considering none of us have any exertanium or quantum computers lying around, the most appreciation our work could get would be to be publicized in the show or a physicist who won't immediately start laughing. So.

Anyway.... wait, when did we get onto this theory? I think I remember trying to argue that the whole "multiple timelines" thing would lead to nothing but a big mess a while back... Your diagram there is a bit confusing ^^;;

I can agree with that though, I guess. Wait, Cassius, what exactly do you mean by saying that the computer can talk to itself outside the RTTP without causing a "third universe"? Are we talking like, theoretical universe or physical one? Cuz RTTP is strictly temporal. A universe can't be created everytime you jump.. that would just phenomenally mess up the existing system. I don't think you meant that though... xD;; Nevermind.

Ugh. *massages temples* I feel like a dinosaur. I miss the old days, when nobody knew what they were talking about. Now everyone's so smart I can barely keep up. And I'm probably the youngest one here. xD;

[Cassius335 offline]

Anyway.... wait, when did we get onto this theory? I think I remember trying to argue that the whole "multiple timelines" thing would lead to nothing but a big mess a while back... Your diagram there is a bit confusing ^^;;I can agree with that though, I guess.

VDV, I'm right there with you. I tried to talk TB3 out of the whole Paradox thing, I really did. But he was too determined. We got into a whole debate involving Back to the Future.

Wait, Cassius, what exactly do you mean by saying that the computer can talk to itself outside the RTTP without causing a "third universe"? Are we talking like, theoretical universe or physical one? Cuz RTTP is strictly temporal. A universe can't be created everytime you jump.. that would just phenomenally mess up the existing system. I don't think you meant that though... xD;; Nevermind.

What did you mean by "Existing system?" Cause this is what was in the to-be-proof-read question everyone was given...

Copies of this data and any changes that have occurred in the computer since the point being returned to are streaming via tachyons to the supercomputer in the past. During this stage the supercomputer is connected to itself and doubles in power as discussed earlier in the section on Qubits.

Once all data has been received in the past the computer uploads the ‘future memories’ of the kids to them via SAPs from the modems. It also installs to itself any new data that had occurred between the current timeframe and the point in the future when the RTTP began – this allows it to shut down XANA’s target tower before it is infected, preventing the attack from occurring.

Therefore the original sequence of events never happens – however this entails a temporal paradox: If the original events never occurred, how do the kids possess memories of it?

The answer is that a ‘ghost’ of the original timeline still exists, imprinted on our own via Quantum Superimposition, cancelling out the possibility of a paradox.

One tragic side-effect though is that anyone who died in the original sequence of events will also die in the new – the Superimposition of timelines means the cessation of any person’s life in the original will carry over into the new via the process of Destructive Interferance (like two sound waves cancelling each other out to create silence) – this is an effect which cannot be prevented in any way, except (possibly) placing the subject in a place where they might be shielded, such as in an energised scanner, or by transferring them to Lyoko, which has a greater chance of success.

What I meant when I said "third universe." was that the resend CompNerd suggested would have to not cause a new paradox in the same way as the first one was caused.

Ugh. *massages temples* I feel like a dinosaur. I miss the old days, when nobody knew what they were talking about. Now everyone's so smart I can barely keep up.

Again, right there with you...

EDIT: How many posts are required for 100% completion.

[Sithking Zero offline]

I think it's about two thousand posts.

[mooshie offline]

the thing about multiple timelines is that ther is an infinetie amout of them, due to quantum probability, there are more than on way things canhappen, therefore every second a new timeline branches of our "lives" are defines by which path we take, not that we have any choice

[Sithking Zero offline]

Yes! That's what I've been saying all along!

[Cassius335 offline]

I think it's about two thousand posts.

Ah...

so why does the progress bar read 99% progress so soon?

the thing about multiple timelines is that ther is an infinetie amout of them, due to quantum probability, there are more than on way things canhappen, therefore every second a new timeline branches of our "lives" are defines by which path we take, not that we have any choice

That's one intepretation, yes. But trying to fit that many timelines into RTTP theory? As YDV said, messy.

[Chupathingy 42 offline]

If I understand what you are trying to suggest with multiple time lines, not only is it messy by the shear number of timelines (as well as jumping from one to the other) there is a many ethical problems (TB3 tried to point that out too).

[YDV offline]

What did you mean by "Existing system?" Cause this is what was in the to-be-proof-read question everyone was given...

Like I said, nevermind. I thought you meant like literal parallel universe, not timeline, and existing system would be the universe that already.. exists... and its set of laws. The introduction of such a thing (assuming there aren't any already) would probably have detrimental effects.

What I meant when I said "third universe." was that the resend CompNerd suggested would have to not cause a new paradox in the same way as the first one was caused.

I see.. thanks, that's cleared up then.

That's precisely why I wanted to avoid the idea in the first place. >>; It does provide for some nice deus ex machina-ish effects, though... (For instance: Why does someone who died not come back? Because their death in one of the timelines cancels out their life in the other! How do memories travel between past and future computers? Multiple timelines! )

[Cassius335 offline]

What I meant when I said "third universe." was that the resend CompNerd suggested would have to not cause a new paradox in the same way as the first one was caused.

I see.. thanks, that's cleared up then.

That's precisely why I wanted to avoid the idea in the first place. >>; It does provide for some nice deus ex machina-ish effects, though... (For instance: Why does someone who died not come back? Because their death in one of the timelines cancels out their life in the other!

I agree with you completely. I liked it MUCH better when we blamed it on the computer miswiring the brains of dead tagged people...

How do memories travel between past and future computers? Multiple timelines! )

Well, not exactly... Ah, now I'll have to dig into the essay again. It takes about a minute to load, you know...

Quantum Dots are so small that electrons become trapped in them, and this is how they compute. Electrons spin in one of two directions, and the spin direction can be used to represent the ‘0’ and ‘1’ used in binary coding. However, because of a curious Quantum Phenomenon known as ‘SUPERIMPOSITION’, the Electrons can be said to spin in BOTH directions at the same time.

A practical example of Superimposition is the hypothetical ‘SCHRODINGER’S CAT’ experiment. Let us put a cat in a box with a death-ray, which has a 50% chance of firing. The box is then sealed – the cat has a 50% chance of being dead and a 50% chance of being alive – Superimposition states that the Cat is therefore alive and dead at the same time, and only the act of looking in the box to check on the cat decides which.

Therefore through Superimposition Quantum Dots can show a value of ‘0’, or ‘1’, or ’0 and 1’ – these are the ‘bits and bytes’ of Quantum Computers and are known as QUBITS.

However, this does not mean Qubits are limited to only three values – they can be potentially infinite – the trick is that at this fundamental level the processors begin working with ‘ghost’ versions of themselves that exist in different Quantum realities, and these ghost processors contain extra Qubit Values – therefore, each Quantum-Dot-Processor could be described as a network of processors, all working together on the same tasks – the only limit to how many Qubits each processor can have, is how many ghosts of itself it has the capacity to detect.

ADDING EXTRA QUBITS
The requirement for adding an extra Qubit to every processor in the computer, is that the computer can ‘learn’ to recognise a new ghost of itself. This requires an immense amount of power, and that occurs through Returning to the Past.

The exact mechanics of the RTTP will be discussed later, but during the process, the computer is connected to itself in two timeframes – present, and past.

When this occurs the two computers briefly exist as a single machine with the combined power of the two – power equal to what would be gained from an extra Qubit. Therefore, the computers can use this new power to locate another ghost version of themselves and tap into it – adding an extra Qubit and making the doubling of power permanent, at which point the process begins again.

This does not occur with every RTTP – if it did the computer would by now have enough Qubits to perform more calculations per second than there are atoms in the universe – in a sense it would have Godly intellect and could perform any function demanded of it – indeed it might be the one making demands of humanity!

Therefore the computer has to work with itself via RTTP many times before it can sense another ghost version of itself – the question is, how many RTTPs are required per Qubit?

We can assume that Franz started with three Qubits – ‘0’, ‘1’ and ‘0/1’ (which in the coding would be represented by ‘2’).

In Season One we saw (when flying through the tunnels between towers) that the supercomputer’s coding was written in the sequence 0-9. Logically, after the events of ‘A Great Day’ the computer would now recognise the values 0-10.

This means the computer has added eight Qubits to the three Franz started with. We know Franz made 2456 time-jumps, and that the kids made at most 100. With these figures in mind (2556 divided by eight) we can see the computer adds a new Qubit after approximately 320 time-wipes, assuming that there is a fixed value.

Note it's time-frame, not timeline. Same time line, but two diffent points interacting.

But yeah, Quantum is involved. There's always quantum!

P.S. You know, the more I look at this, the more I think "Destructive Interference" (the biggest Duex-Ex-Queen-Machina here) goes against the whole point of quantum. Why does 0 and 1 both equal "dead"?

[Sithking Zero offline]

I always figured that the supercomputer made a connection to every living thing, and erased the memories of those not tagged before sending the minds back in time. Thusly, a dead person's mind would not have a mental signiture, and the supercomputer would send back a void, erasing everything in the brain and stopping all bodily funcitions.

At least, that's how I thought I understood it.

[Cassius335 offline]

That'd take way too much processing power. I figure it'd be tagged people that'd get memory wiped (maybe to cut down on quantum echoes (deja-vu) or somesuch? )?and then a new version of their brains is installed. If they're dead, it might be that there's nothing to install, so the brain is left wiped.

The Lyoko Gang, on the other hand, perhaps due to a different 'level' of tag, don't get mind-wiped; their future memories are simply installed over the old ones.

[Jeremified offline]

OT: Has anybody heard anything from TB3 since he left?

[Rudger offline]

yeah thats kind of weird. where is he. there should be intenet access somwhere out there.

Thinking horrible thoughts because I just watched final destination 1.

[TB3]

Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack!

Okay - how do I put this nicely...

JEROME LIKES LTT AND GAVE THE ESSAY TO THE PRODUCERS! YAHOO! WOHOOO!



Now then - bed calls, so seeya guys later!

[Cassius335 offline]

Glad to know you're back. If it's the morning and you're reading this WE WANT DETAILS!!!

[Jeremified offline]

Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack!

Okay - how do I put this nicely...

JEROME LIKES LTT AND GAVE THE ESSAY TO THE PRODUCERS! YAHOO! WOHOOO!



Now then - bed calls, so seeya guys later!

8D;; WEWT! Maybe Lyokofreak'll win a prize. Like. Promotion on other CL websites. Or maybe they'll ship TB3 and Cassius and Erynn and all the other dudes some prize...

*smacks forehead* Duh. Donation to website.

[Sithking Zero offline]

Or give us the episodes early! Or (dare I say it) give us tickets to see an anime convention where we could meet the VA'S!! (that's my dream. Meet at least one VA of one show that I like).

[Lani offline]

Admittance to a con usually isn't that expensive... unless you're shooting for like Anime Expo, then explect to pay a pretty penny <s>I've stood next to Monica Rial!! Dx</s>

ANYWAY. Omg, TB3, that is WONDERFUL!! So glad to hear that!! So if he gave it to the producers, I'm guessing we'll hear some of the stuff [mostly you guys] came up with? YAY! Hmmm.. maybe we'll get equal treatment as CL.net and CL.fr now >D

[Sithking Zero offline]

Okay, TB3. We don't want much. Just tell EVERY SINGLE DETAIL OF YOUR TRIP!!!!!


This does inlude acurate data on Jerome, including heart rate, facial expression, and every single thing he said to you.

[JeremieCompNerd offline]

Good to see you back TB3. I can't wait to "hear" what happened over there.
Don't forget to reread the thread, I'd like your oppinion on my theory.

[Tangent128 offline]

I like your theory; I spend a lot of time thinking about time travel, and I've come to accept the Novikov Self-Consistency Principle- essentially, although time travel may happen, it is impossible to perform any action that would cause a paradox; if you try to shoot your grandfather, your gun will misfire, you'll miss, you'll have the wrong guy, etc. I think this theory allows a single timeline to exist without paradox.

Basically, the "original" RTTP activated at the end of a XANA attack would send the memories back in time, but since that would be inconsistant, that couldn't have happened; something must prevent it. A RTTP failure would be the simplest way to prevent a paradox, but the supercomputer is built reliably enough that is extremly unlikely. As such, if a more probable way to avoid paradox is available, that would happen instead; it just so happens that one does exist- the supercomputer is programed to preserve causality, so any message from the future it receives it will "backward" to itself at some point in the future.
As such, the "true" timeline looks like this:
-XANA plans an attack.
-The supercomputer receives memories from the future.
-The supercomputer distributes the memories, and prevents the tower activation.
-The supercomputer sends the memories into the past, completing the loop.

The timeline where XANA attacked never existed, except in the minds of Team Lyoko and the Supercomputer's memory- quite literally a virtual timeline.

(To prevent random memories from being dumped into thier minds for no reason, the supercomputer probably only acts on memories that are consistant and end with a RTTP.)